This glance at the subject is a little in advance of the correspondence; but it will be useful as a key to the points of discussion thrown up in its progress. The fulness and freshness of the letters, written daily, and containing the most minute history of those proceedings that has yet appeared in print, requires such slight elucidation as to render it undesirable to interrupt their continuity by commentaries, except where it may become necessary to direct attention to some special matter.
Both parties were now gathering their allies around them, and preparing for a contest which was not very creditable to the political character of the Opposition. In the meanwhile a third party was forming, which, trying to reconcile hopeless antagonisms, ran its head against a crotchet, resisting the restrictions on the one hand, and supporting Mr. Pitt, as Minister, on the other, for the sake of his popularity and transcendant abilities. This line of conduct is justly described by Mr. Grenville as "absolute nonsense."
MR. W. W. GRENVILLE TO THE MARQUIS OF BUCKINGHAM.
Whitehall, Dec. 9th, 1788.
My dear Brother,
The messenger who carries this is sent for the purpose of collecting proxies. It is, you know, necessary that they should be renewed every session; for which reason I have desired that a blank proxy should be directed to you, which I suppose you will fill up, as before, with Fortescue's name. He is quite eager (especially for him), and came up to town for the first day. I think there is every reason to hope that we shall not stand in need of this sort of canvass, either for the House of Commons or the House of Lords; but you will certainly agree with me, that no pains are superfluous when such points are in question.
I do not learn that there is any foundation for the report which I mentioned to you of the round-robin entered into by their Royal Highnesses. The partizans of Opposition are, however, still circulating, with great industry, the idea that the Prince of Wales has positively declared his resolution not to accept the Regency under any restrictions whatever. I take this, however, to be nothing more than a bully, intended to influence votes in the House of Commons. If, however, he should be so desperate, I should hope there would be every reason to believe that the Queen would be induced to take the Regency, in order to prevent the King's hands from being fettered for the remainder of his life. Nothing has yet passed with respect to this subject. Pitt has seen her once; but the conversation was nothing more than general, although with the greatest civility, and even kindness, on her part towards him.
We receive every day new professions of attachment; and I do not yet hear of any one individual of any consequence whom we shall lose, except, probably, the Duke of Queensbury. The Duke of Grafton has declared himself explicitly. There is no longer any doubt of Thurlow; and there never has been any of Lord Stafford, Lord Weymouth, &c. Lord Lonsdale is still uncertain, and so is, I believe, the Duke of Northumberland – though this will have been brought to a point by this time. The general idea is, that he has connected himself with the Independents, of which there was some appearance last session. It is said that they mean to support Pitt as the Minister, but to oppose any restrictions on the Regent. This is not the less likely to be their conduct, on account of its being absolute nonsense.
With respect to individuals in the House of Commons, there are several who have long been wavering, and who have sent the most positive assurances of support.
There is every reason to believe that the country will continue entirely with us, and that addresses will be presented from all parts to the Regent, to continue the Government. I am afraid that, in point of time, nothing can be done of that sort in Ireland, without exposing you to much embarrassment.
I conceive that our Regent will probably be appointed, the Bill passed, &c., &c., by about the 10th or 12th of January, and that we shall then immediately be dismissed. You certainly must remain till your Parliament has met and appointed the Regent for Ireland, because there is no one else who can vacate your commission; and I think the contrivances which you once mentioned for avoiding it, are liable to great objections. Now, you will observe, that the addresses from Ireland could not be presented to the Prince of Wales till he was Irish Regent, and that it would be a very awkward thing to have the people there addressing him to continue you in Ireland, after you had declared your own resolution to quit it in consequence of the removal of your friends here. I wish you would consider all this attentively, because, if these difficulties could be removed, it would certainly be very desirable that it should appear as far as possible to be the united sense of all the three kingdoms, as well as of both Houses of Parliament, and of the King, that the present Government should remain; and that these Whigs should recommend the dismission in the teeth of all these.
Willis sent last night a note to Pitt about his attendance at the Committee to-day. In a postscript, he tells him that he thinks the King better and more composed than he has been since he has attended him.
Ever most affectionately yours,
W. W. G.
A new question and a new embarrassment now arose, as to what was to be done about the Regency in Ireland. It was natural enough that the Prince of Wales should be popular in Ireland as a pis aller, on account of the known antipathy of the King to the Catholic claims; and it was apprehended that the Irish Parliament, acting independently of English precedent, would declare itself in favour of an unlimited Regency. The anxiety to which Lord Buckingham was exposed by this disturbing prospect (some people went so far as to cast the horoscope of an Irish revolution), and by the delays in the receipt of intelligence, owing to the imperfect and irregular means of communication existing between the two countries, betrayed him into some expressions of impatience, against which Mr. Grenville remonstrated with his habitual temperance and good sense, throwing out at the same time some sound suggestions as to the course it was desirable the Lord-Lieutenant should pursue. There are no qualities in these letters, wherever reference is made to the conduct of public men in great crises, more worthy of unmixed admiration than their practical sagacity and complete self-control.
MR. W. W. GRENVILLE TO THE MARQUIS OF BUCKINGHAM.
Whitehall, Dec. 10th, 1788.
My dear Brother,
Your messenger having been, as he says, four or five days at sea, has just brought me your letter of the 2nd. I cannot avoid expressing to you the mortification I felt, on finding it filled with complaints of want of communication. It is now more than a month that I have written to you constantly seven days in the week, with the exception, I believe, of not four days in the whole time. I do this, not only without reluctance, but with pleasure, because I think it contributes to your satisfaction, and because it is a real relief to my mind to converse with you in this manner on the subjects which are, in the present moment, so interesting to us both. But I do it often under circumstances of so much other business, as makes it impossible for me to keep any copies or memoranda of what I write. I cannot, therefore, distinctly call back to my mind the thread of that correspondence; but, as far as my memory serves, I solemnly protest I know of no one fact, opinion, or conjecture, that could be of the least use to you, or could even satisfy your curiosity, that I have not regularly communicated to you as it arose.
You seem to have mistaken some expression in one of my letters, and to have understood that the proposition itself relating to the Regency was to have been brought forward on Thursday last. You will since have seen, that the preliminary steps require so much time, that it must still be Monday, or more probably Wednesday next, before anything can be moved. But you say that you have received no communication of the extent or wording of that plan, so as to consider its legal or political effect towards Ireland. On this, I can only say, that long before the outlines of that plan were finally settled, even, I believe, in Mr. Pitt's mind, certainly long before they were at all agreed upon by the Cabinet, I communicated them to you distinctly, and at length. There has since been no variation in these. With respect to the precise wording of the plan, I do not know that this is yet decided upon; nor do I suppose it can be so, till within a few hours of its being moved. But as to any legal effect which it can have upon Ireland, I have certainly failed in what I intended to do, if I have not stated to you a clear opinion, that no measure taken in Parliament here can possibly affect Ireland any otherwise than as a precedent, which every Irishman must think himself bound to follow, who does not wish to separate the two countries. It surely could not be your wish, nor would it be desirable, to attempt to pledge any Irishman one step beyond that general proposition, that whatever is done by the authority of the British Parliament as to England, must be done in Ireland by the authority of the Irish Parliament; but that the latter will grossly betray the interests of their own country, if they do not adopt the English measure, whatever that may ultimately be. I trust that we shall be able to carry the measure here, such as I stated to you long ago, some time before your Parliament meets; but if it should fail, and any different form be established, I hope we should be the last men in the two countries to wish to disunite them on this ground.
I cannot but repeat, that the expressions and style of your letter have hurt me sensibly. I do not believe, that if you were living in Pall Mall, you could be more distinctly or regularly informed of what passes. You will, of course, hear in Dublin, as you would in Pall Mall, an infinite variety of foolish reports, as is naturally the case when every man has his own speculation. You cannot, I am sure, think it possible that I can even enumerate, much less argue upon, or contradict all these; but I cannot, at this time, after some reflection, call to my mind any point of the smallest consequence in our present situation with which I am myself acquainted, and which I have omitted to state.
With respect to your own particular situation, I conceive that it is not possible that things can be brought to the point of affecting that for several weeks to come. The measure which is to be brought forward here will, of course, meet with violent opposition; and cannot, according to my calculation, be completed, so as to put the Prince of Wales in possession of the Regency, till the first or second week in January. I think as soon as you receive the notification that this measure has passed in England, it would be right for you to write a very short letter to the Secretary of State, mentioning in a very few words the opinions of lawyers there, that your patent can be vacated only by a Regent appointed by the Irish Parliament, suggesting the expedient of Lords Justices; and then desiring to know His Royal Highness's pleasure, whether he chooses that under those circumstances you should meet the Parliament, for the purpose of laying before them the circumstances of the present situation, or whether you should name Lords Justices, and who they should be. You see, I put this on the supposition that you are not immediately removed, which, for many reasons, I think unlikely. You know my opinion has always been that the Prince would not negotiate, and I am every day more confirmed in it. But I think it may be a question, whether he may not choose to look about him a little. Perhaps, however, in order to anticipate any sudden step, you would do well to send a letter such as I mention, so as to reach England a few days before the measure can pass, and to be here ready to be laid before him when he does accept. In a point of such importance, it seems to me that it would be proper that you should have, for your own justification, the written opinions of your lawyers on the point I mention, but not to send them over here. I mention this as a general idea; but wish you to consider it, because I am sure, in general, the less you write on this subject the better, in order that you may not give ground of misquoting, or misrepresenting what you say.
As to the idea of vesting the Government in Lords Justices, or taking any step for throwing up the Government in the interval, except with the consent and by the direction of the Prince of Wales, I should most earnestly deprecate it for a thousand reasons; but, above all, for the impression which it would give here of abandoning the interests of this country in Ireland, for the sake of adding to the confusion, and creating factious difficulties. I think your line clear, and that you have nothing to do but to sit still saying or doing nothing till our measure passes. You then ask the Prince of Wales whether he chooses that you or any Lords Justices should meet Parliament; and if he directs you to stay, you have nothing to do but to express to anybody that asks you, your wish that the English measure should be precisely followed. Whatever, under such circumstances, is the conduct of the Irish Parliament, you cannot be responsible for it, unless you make yourself so.
There is another urgent reason against your taking any step for breaking up your Government: the King is daily getting better, and has been continuing so to do ever since Sunday. Willis's examination before the Committee yesterday, was all but decisive as to the certainty of his recovery in a short time. I will send it to you in the course of to-morrow, or the next day; but these are the material parts. He is asked what hopes he entertains of the King's recovery? He says he entertains great hopes; that if it was the case of a common man, he should have no doubt of his recovery; but in the King's situation, his own reflections on his situation, when he begins to recover his reason, may retard the cure. (A good lesson, by the bye, to the Prince of Wales, &c.) He says he cannot yet affirm that there are signs of convalescence, but that there is everything leading to it; particularly that the irritation has almost entirely subsided, which must precede convalescence, or any appearance of it. He is asked with respect to his own experience, &c.? He says, that of ten patients brought to him within three months of their being attacked, nine have recovered. That the smallest time he remembers, is six weeks or two months from their being brought to him; the longest, a year and a half; the average, about five months.
With this account, it is not very sanguine to hope that the King's actual recovery may take place before the measure can pass here; or, at least, such a prospect of it as may make it absolutely impossible for the Prince, whatever his disposition may be, to change the Government. If the amendment continues, it may even be a question whether further adjournment may not be thought right, though the inconveniences of this, particularly with respect to foreign affairs, are so great that it must not be done but upon very strong grounds indeed.
The nonsense about dissolution has been talked in England as well as in Ireland; but I cannot persuade myself that it really comes from Lord Loughborough. It has not made its fortune much here. Anybody who had the smallest knowledge of the general turn and bent of the public mind, both in and out of Parliament, would not have broached so foolish an idea.
I told you, in one of my former letters, that I was utterly at a loss to guess what Bernard's motive was for going to Ireland in the moment which he chose. I stated my wishes against it; but I saw that there was some mystery behind, which he did not wish to explain, and therefore I pressed him no more about it.
Adieu, my dear brother. I hate writing anything to you, which can bear even the appearance of complaint. I feel for the disagreeableness of your situation at this moment: being at a distance from the scene of events which interest you so much, and from any conversation with those in whom you most confide. But I am sure you will, on reflection, acquit me of any want of attention to you on the head of communication.
I am much obliged to you for your anxiety about myself. I had a slight attack of fever for a day or two; but it is now entirely gone.
Five o'clock.
I am just returned from the Committee, who have finished the examination of the physicians. The examinations of to-day are not very material; but as far as they go, they confirm our favourable hopes. Another account is just come from Kew, that the King has continued better ever since the account of this morning, which is the public one.
Pitt is to move to-day for the Committee of Precedents. Fox told us he meant to say a few words against it, as unnecessary, but not to divide; so I shall not go down again.
The notion of the Prince of Wales not accepting, seems to lose ground; and all these favourable accounts of the King are evidently strong grounds of argument for our measures.
SIR WILLIAM YOUNG TO THE MARQUIS OF BUCKINGHAM.
Stratton Street, Thursday, Dec. 11th, 1788.
My dear Lord,
I did not receive your kind letter of Dec. 2nd, until my arrival last night from the House of Commons, when it was too late to write, and the conversation which then arose was of so important a nature, that it was not practicable or proper to steal a moment from the debate, or to send a line respecting it ere it was closed, and the subject took a decisive turn, which was after the post hour.
To a friendship so dear and honourable to me as yours, and shown me by so many instances of goodness, the best answer I can make is, through life, by a return of grateful attachment, honour, and disinterestedness; and in these, if I aught know myself, I shall never fail.
Of the momentous business opened last night, I can only say that our astonishment is only to be equalled by the spirits we are in, on viewing the grounds Mr. Fox hath abandoned to us and left our own. Lord Radnor, who breakfasted with me this morning, told me he understands that Fox's doctrine, "that the Prince of Wales was Regent, invested with full regal authority immediately and de jure on the incapacity, however temporary, of the King, and that the two Houses of Parliament had no right to debate thereon even," came from that constitutional lawyer, Lord Loughborough. Radnor's further remark, that Fox, having on a former occasion sought to trespass on the royal just prerogative, had now completed his attack on the Constitution, in denying the rights of Lords and Commons, is worthy observation. Talbot, who made one of my morning's levée, told me that at White's last night, all was hurra! and triumph. Charles Sturt and other youngsters took part at the bar, to echo the "Hear, hear," from Fitzpatrick and Burke, of Fox's doctrine; yet the "Hear, hear," was but little caught or repeated, though given loudly. Looking back to the history of this "Man of the People," and to his present conduct, in despite of his talents of logical discrimination, I begin almost to doubt whether his weakness or profligacy is transcendant. Pitt's language was most masterly and decisive; and has been done but little justice to in the papers of this day. The general tenor of subject they will give you, but what I have seen does not touch on the overthrow of Fox's resort to the doctrine that Parliament was of "Kings, Lords, and Commons; that no two branches thereof could make a law," by the just and constitutional distinction between the two Houses making a law, and the providing or giving efficiency to the third executive branch of Legislature in cases of defect, whatever it may be. The report of the physicians being ordered to be printed, will be out to-morrow, when I will send it, with a few remarks. Our great days are to be Monday and Tuesday.
It will scarcely escape your Lordship's penetration, that when Fox said recognition of the Prince's claim de jure to be the sole right and province of Parliament, implied an act of the House to debate, and, if to debate, to decide upon. So idle is genius! I see through the motive power: if Parliament has a right to confer power, it has a right to say what sort of power. So far Fox's penetration reached, and so he boldly denied the major of the proposition; and then, in a puzzle for consistency of popular attachment to good old rights of the Lords and Commons, and his subscription to the pillar at Runnymede, run into the contradiction of admitting the major in shape of recognitions. It is impossible yet to foresee what tergiversation will take place, or how many will sacrifice their principles to the rising sun; forgetting that apostacy to honest principles requires that there should be a transcendancy of merit of another sort – namely, of great ability to be useful to make that apostacy acceptable or the object of remuneration. Hating the traitor and loving the treason, is a state maxim to be remembered by those whose treason is scarcely ever to be regarded while themselves are the objects of civil contempt. Yet some hold a language of doubt. One or two, whom I will not yet name, I told if they had not made up an opinion, they had better ask their constituents for one. It seems to me, that the business must close in a resort to the sense of the nation. In what shape such resort may possibly, I think not probably, be made, is serious indeed. But the violence of the faction of Fox portends every evil. Perhaps, however, and most likely, the resort to a new election, may give us time to grow cool, and close matters there. Adieu, for the day.
Ever, my dear Lord, in truth and affection,
Your devoted friend and servant,
Wm. Young.
LORD BULKELEY TO THE MARQUIS OF BUCKINGHAM.
Stanhope Street, Dec. 11th, 1788.
My dear Lord,
The scene here is a very busy one, and I never was so interested in any public measures in my life as in the support of Mr. Pitt and the King at this moment, looking upon it as my duty to do all in my power to stem the torrent of profligacy which the Opposition and their King seem determined to hazard with the good sense, decency, and character of the country. I really do see such things, and hear of such doings, that my tolerant spirit cannot forgive, and if you had not very good information of them, I should think myself bound to treat you with them. The Nevilles, Fortescues, Jemmy, and the General, being in town, we make a very strong corps together; and we are sent to White's every night to gain intelligence for our ladies, who are not a little animated in favour of the good cause. Charles Fox and Pitt were at issue yesterday in the House, when the former advanced the most extraordinary doctrines, considering his former opinions in the Whig Club and in Parliament on constitutional points. I hope the nation will see what lengths he is capable of going when it answers his purposes. I do not hear of many rats running as yet, except the Duke of Queensbury, Lord Brudenell, and W. Gerrard, Hamilton, and Sir Robert Smyth, but probably some more dirty dogs will follow them. The Chancellor seems very sour and crusty, and certainly does not like Pitt, but I cannot believe he will do otherwise than right on this momentous occasion.
* * * * *
We sat yesterday till eight, in the Lords, and thought Lord Camden imprudent in touching upon what had passed in the Commons the day before, as it gave the Opposition an excuse for being violent; it, however, had one good effect, that the Chancellor opened enough of his sentiments to show that he means to stand by his colleagues. His speech was not long, but one of the finest I ever heard, and made so strong an impression, that we gave him a merry "Hear, hear," which you know is not very frequent in the House of Lords. I think we shall carry the question of restrictions very powerfully in the Lords, as I hear of no rats but the Duke of Queensbury, the Duke of St. Albans, and Lord Rodney. In the Commons, a great deal will depend on the state of the King's health at the time the question comes on, and on the previous activity of Pitt and his two secretaries, in talking a little to dubious friends, which they have not time nor inclination to do, notwithstanding so much depends upon it.
Adieu, my dear Lord. Our joint and kindest love and remembrance attend you both.
Yours ever, &c.
Pray order your secretary to send me word of the number and income of the tide-waiters' offices which you can spare me, as I have dependants enough if they are as highly paid in Ireland as in England. In the meantime I give you the name of John Thomas, for one of them. Did you ever promote one Alexander Gammach, tide-waiter at Belfast? Pray do before you quit Ireland.
MR. W. W. GRENVILLE TO THE MARQUIS OF BUCKINGHAM.
Whitehall, Dec. 11th, 1788.
My dear Brother,
You will, no doubt, be as much surprised as I was, to find that the notion of the Prince of Wales's right was brought forward yesterday by Fox in the House of Commons. It was a matter of no less astonishment to many of his own friends, who were by no means prepared for the assertion of such a doctrine. One should lose oneself in conjecture, by attempting to find out what motive can have induced him to take exactly the most unpopular ground on which their side of the question can be rested. I was not in the House; but I find there was an impression on our friends, that in his second speech he had rather seemed desirous of stating the proposition less strongly.
Our present idea is, that it will be right, in consequence of this debate, that nothing should be moved on the first day (which, I think, cannot be till Wednesday) beyond the abstract proposition, as maintained by Pitt; namely, that in every case of suspension or interruption of the personal exercise of the royal authority, otherwise than by death, the care of making provision for the emergency rests with the two Houses of Parliament. These are not the words, but the substance. A stronger question we cannot desire.
12th. – I intended to have sent this off to you yesterday; but was kept in the House of Lords till it was too late. You will see by the papers, better than I can pretend to retail it, what passed there. The doctrine, as stated by Lord Loughborough, was not quite so strong as Fox's; but is sufficiently so, to be reprobated by every lawyer in the country. Even Erskine says openly, that he cannot go this length.
The idea is, and some words which Fox dropped yesterday in the House of Lords seem to confirm it, that whenever the report of our Committee of Precedents is made, which will probably be to-day, or, at latest, to-morrow, he intends to explain away his assertion, into the mere statement, that the Prince has such pretensions to a Regency as Parliament cannot overlook. Be this as it may, we are determined to state the right distinctly, by a resolution of the House, before we proceed to any other measures.
Fortescue has this instant been with me, to say that he has heard a report, said to come from a considerable Oppositionist, that they have resolved, in consequence of the examinations and particularly Willis's, to accede to the proposed restrictions, for a short time, reserving to themselves the right of contending for more, should the continuance of the King's illness appear to give grounds to expect that it will be permanent. I do not think this by any means impossible, because the question will clearly go against them in the present moment; and this appearance of moderation may give them grounds at a more distant period. It is difficult, however, to conceive that they can make up their minds to wait so long without a greater struggle.
Only think of Fox's want of judgment, to bring himself and them into such a scrape as he has done, by maintaining a doctrine of higher Tory principle than could have been found anywhere, since Sir Robert Sawyer's speeches.
I enclose the examination of the physicians before our Committee. I am sorry to say, that the examination before the Lords is infinitely less decent and respectful, and goes into a variety of particulars, which, I am sure it will shock you to read, as it did me to hear them.
Ever most affectionately yours,
W. W. G.
I do not know in what manner what Thurlow said about Ireland will be represented in the papers, not having seen them. It was so enveloped, that I, who heard it, could form no notion what his opinion is. In the debate in the House of Commons, I mean, for your sake, to state my principles on that subject distinctly.
Sir William Young, in the next letter, reports what was done on Pitt's motion for the Committee.
SIR WILLIAM YOUNG TO THE MARQUIS OF BUCKINGHAM.
House of Commons, Friday, Half-past Five, Dec, 12th, 1788.
My dear Lord,
Fox got up, on Mr. Pitt's having moved for a Committee to inquire into the state of the nation on Tuesday. Fox explained away much of the harshness of the doctrine of right in the Prince of Wales to assume the royal authority during the temporary incapacity of the King; but left all the substance of the doctrine. He then spoke his sentiments of what ought to be done, whatever the manner; namely, to recognize, or confer, as others might say, full regal authority on the Prince, for the time of the King's incapacity. He then called on Pitt to relieve the nation from doubt, and give an opening of his plan.
Pitt, in reply, stated the point of law and the Constitution yet to be at issue, the substance of difference yet remaining, and that such great question could not be slurred over. It must be decided by Parliament, and should be the first subject of debate and decision; namely, for Tuesday. It was a question for themselves and for posterity. He then said, that the outline of his plan was, as matter of discretion and conveniency, to appoint the Prince of Wales sole Regent, with no permanent council, with power to remove and make his Ministry at pleasure, and with all other regal powers necessary for giving force, dignity, and vigour to his Administration; but with no powers that might be needless, intrench on the Crown, and cause embarrassment on the King's recovery, &c.
Our business for Tuesday, therefore, is the question of right.
Pitt stands higher and higher in general estimation. As I passed the gallery to write this, Marquis of Townsend caught my arm, and said: "A glorious fellow, by G – , Young! His speech is that of an angel."
Post bell rings.
Yours ever,
W. Y.
MR. W. W. GRENVILLE TO THE MARQUIS OF BUCKINGHAM.
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